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Helsinki Python🇫🇮🐍 Welcome to this month's meetup on Tuesday 15th April 2025 at Reaktor!Talks:🧪 <a href="https://mas.to/@maaretp" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@maaretp</a> - Exploratory Unit Testing with and for GenAI🪈 Toni Vanhala - Stable and Observable: Celery Setup Essentials for SQL Pipelines⁉️ And the famous HelPy quiz!<a href="https://www.meetup.com/helpy-meetups/events/307043355/" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://www.meetup.com/helpy-meetups/events/307043355/</a>See you there!<a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/HelPy" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#HelPy</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/Helsinki" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Helsinki</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/Python" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Python</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/meetup" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#meetup</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/testing" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#testing</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/GenAI" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#GenAI</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/Celery" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Celery</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/SQL" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#SQL</a> <a href="https://fosstodon.org/tags/Pipelines" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Pipelines</a>

Buttered JortsHey Mastodon, question for my <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/sysadmin" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#sysadmin</a> and <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/DevOps" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#DevOps</a> types. Has anyone used <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/Pester" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Pester</a> and <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/PSScriptAnalyzer" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#PSScriptAnalyzer</a> to set up unit testing for test driven development, particularly on (relatively) simple <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/PowerShell" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#PowerShell</a> scripts like you might use for application detection, installation, and uninstallation from a system like <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/SCCM" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#SCCM</a> <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/Intune" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Intune</a> or <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/ManageEngine" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#ManageEngine</a> ?Apologies for the buzzword bingo, but I’m trying to reach folks who may be following the hashtags, but not necessarily have a connection otherwise.<a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/TDD" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#TDD</a> <a href="https://infosec.exchange/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a>

Gary "grim" Kramlich<a href="https://fosstodon.org/@pidgin" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@pidgin</a> Also if anyone wants to explore more themselves, meson makes this really easy.From the top of our source tree you can run meson with the following commandmeson build -Db_coverage=true -Dgplugin:vapi=false build-coverageThe vala bindings need to be disabled because the confuse gcovr.Once configuration is done you can run the tests and generate the coverage report with the followingcd build-coverage ninja turtles ninja coverage-html<a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Pidgin" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Pidgin</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Development" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Development</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Coverage" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Coverage</a>

Gary "grim" Kramlich<a href="https://fosstodon.org/@pidgin" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@pidgin</a> Some more info. Keep in mind that the 130 suites include libraries we maintain as well, but the code coverage here does not include.Also, the coverage includes, libpurple, pidgin, and the protocol plugins and that pidgin and the protocol plugins aren't exactly testable although we have some stuff we're working on for that.<a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Pidgin" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Pidgin</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Coverage" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Coverage</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Development" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Development</a>

Felix NeumannIn a way it’s similar to the people who generate <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> for the code they’ve just written. Nothing against those who have this big chunk of untested legacy code and happily see that <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/AI" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#AI</a> gives them a good starting ground of test cases.But like with commit messages, unit tests can answer that WHY question about your production code. Why do we need that strange if branch? Oooh because of that edge case occurring in a given use case, tested by this test case over there. That’s something you can’t derive from your production code.In <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/TDD" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#TDD</a>, your test cases give your production code a reason to exist. In that sense, you’d be much better off to have AI generate the production code for your tests.

Toni AittoniemiOne thing for my job I’m looking forward to about <a href="https://mastodon.green/tags/AI" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#AI</a>: Refactoring large systemsDoing a refactoring that involves hundreds of classes and multiple changes of infrastructure has been a thing that can take weeks, even months.However, if you have good test coverage, you can let an LLM can do the drudge work for you and just verify it did what it said it did.TTD is a must anyway, if you use LLM’s for helping you werite code. <a href="https://mastodon.green/tags/programming" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#programming</a> <a href="https://mastodon.green/tags/refactoring" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#refactoring</a> <a href="https://mastodon.green/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a>

Alvin AshcraftMigrate from MSTest to xUnit using a Roslyn analyzer by Gérald Barré. <a href="https://www.meziantou.net/migrate-from-mstest-to-xunit-using-a-roslyn-analyzer.htm" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.meziantou.net/migrate-from-mstest-to-xunit-using-a-roslyn-analyzer.htm</a> <a href="https://bsky.app/search?q=%23dotnet" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#dotnet</a> <a href="https://bsky.app/search?q=%23roslyn" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#roslyn</a> <a href="https://bsky.app/search?q=%23csharp" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#csharp</a> <a href="https://bsky.app/search?q=%23mstest" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#mstest</a> <a href="https://bsky.app/search?q=%23xunit" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#xunit</a> <a href="https://bsky.app/search?q=%23unittests" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> <a href="https://bsky.app/search?q=%23migration" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#migration</a> <a href="https://www.meziantou.net/migrate-from-mstest-to-xunit-using-a-roslyn-analyzer.htm" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Migrate from MSTest to xUnit u...</a>

sumanthvepaFor example, for my command line deployment tool <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/dralithus" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#dralithus</a>, the parameterized test suite consists of more than 3,500 individual tests with different combinations of deployment configurations. Writing individual unit tests simply doesn't scale.This is particularly true if you are building a data driven software pipeline.This also makes it possible to do test driven development more effectively.<a href="https://github.com/sumanthvepa/dralithus-core" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://github.com/sumanthvepa/dralithus-core</a><a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/softwaredevelopment" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#softwaredevelopment</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/programming" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#programming</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/testing" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#testing</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a>

sumanthvepa<a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Python" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Python</a> really needs better support for <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/parameterised" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#parameterised</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a>. The paremeterized python package is okay, but leaves much to be desired. I would love have package that integrates with my <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/IDE" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#IDE</a>, (<a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/VScode" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#VScode</a>, <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/PyCharm" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#PyCharm</a>) etc.

Bogomil Shopov - БогоA friend of mine is looking for one/two freelancers for the following - Writing <a href="https://hapyyr.com/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> in <a href="https://hapyyr.com/tags/python" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#python</a> - Basic <a href="https://hapyyr.com/tags/pqsql" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#pqsql</a> dB optimization. Ideally from <a href="https://hapyyr.com/tags/Europe" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Europe</a>. If you are one or know one, please DM me.<a href="https://hapyyr.com/tags/getfedihired" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#getfedihired</a>

Ernst Greiner 🇪🇺FluentAssertions v8.0 will cost $ 130,- per Developer. Just watched Nicks video...<a href="https://techhub.social/tags/dotnet" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#dotnet</a> <a href="https://techhub.social/tags/csharp" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#csharp</a> <a href="https://techhub.social/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> <a href="https://techhub.social/tags/FluentAssertions" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#FluentAssertions</a> <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFc6jcaM6Ms" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFc6jcaM6Ms</a>

Preston Maness ☭A new person! @toastiehealth@tiktok.com <a href="https://www.tiktok.com/@toastiehealth/video/7457799816962215176" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://www.tiktok.com/@toastiehealth/video/7457799816962215176</a><a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/SoftwareEngineering" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#SoftwareEngineering</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/SoftwareDevelopment" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#SoftwareDevelopment</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/software" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#software</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/corecore" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#corecore</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/hopelesscore" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#hopelesscore</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/hopelessnesscore" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#hopelessnesscore</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/tiktok" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#tiktok</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/programming" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#programming</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a> <a href="https://tenforward.social/tags/TDD" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#TDD</a>

Jan :rust: :ferris:UwU, I've just found out about `SystemState` in <a href="https://floss.social/tags/Bevy" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Bevy</a> :awesome: <a href="https://docs.rs/bevy/latest/bevy/ecs/system/struct.SystemState.html" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://docs.rs/bevy/latest/bevy/ecs/system/struct.SystemState.html</a>It basically allows you to circumvent (mutable) borrowing issues with `App` and `World` when you have exclusive `World` access. As it turns out, this is especially useful in <a href="https://floss.social/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a>. 🧪 ✅ See next two toots for an example...1/3<a href="https://floss.social/tags/BevyEngine" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#BevyEngine</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/UnitTest" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTest</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/Testing" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Testing</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/GameDev" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#GameDev</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/BevyUI" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#BevyUI</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/UI" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UI</a>

Jan :rust: :ferris:Ah, turns out I was totally stupid! 🤦 I've forgotten to include the following Plugin:TextPluginWhen testing in a separate crate with 0.14, I had included it, but not in my new 0.15 project. Stupid me!😖 Now layouts are correctly calculated in tests. :awesome: I apologize to everyone for the confusion and especially to the <a href="https://floss.social/tags/Bevy" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Bevy</a> project for blaming them of something that was totally my oversight. 😳 <a href="https://floss.social/tags/BevyEngine" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#BevyEngine</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/Sorry" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Sorry</a> <a href="https://floss.social/tags/Mistake" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Mistake</a>

Jan Van RyswyckI wonder how many software teams today are still betting heavily on UI tests, struggling with their nondeterministic behaviour, near-impossible diagnostics, slowness, verbosity and utter lack of design feedback. There is a better way: small, fast-running test. We know this. It has been stated more than 30 years ago. If only we learn those lessons from the past.<a href="https://archive.org/details/The_Smalltalk_Report_0402" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://archive.org/details/The_Smalltalk_Report_0402</a><a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/tdd" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#tdd</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/softwaredesign" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#softwaredesign</a>(4/4)

Jan Van RyswyckHe then goes on:"My solution is to write the tests (and check results) in Smalltalk. Although this approach has the disadvantage that your testers need to be able to write simple Smalltalk programs, the resulting tests are much more stable."<a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/tdd" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#tdd</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/softwaredesign" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#softwaredesign</a>(3/4)

Jan Van RyswyckWhen explaining the philosophy behind the SmallUnit framework, he mentions the following:"The most radical philosophy espoused here is a rejection of user-interface-based tests. In my experience, tests based on user interface scripts are too brittle to be useful. Testers spend more time keeping the tests up to date and tracking down false failures and false successes than they do writing new tests.”<a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/tdd" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#tdd</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/softwaredesign" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#softwaredesign</a>(2/4)

Jan Van RyswyckWhile researching the history of Extreme Programming, I came across this article from Kent Beck, published in The Smalltalk Report of October 1994, titled "Simple Smalltalk Testing". The article laid out the concept of Test-Driven Development.<a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/tdd" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#tdd</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/unittests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#unittests</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/softwaredesign" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#softwaredesign</a>(1/4)

robrich<a href="https://dev.to/baduit/what-if-i-told-you-you-dont-have-to-run-your-unit-tests--k0" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://dev.to/baduit/what-if-i-told-you-you-dont-have-to-run-your-unit-tests--k0</a> - If you can validate at <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/compile" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#compile</a> time, you don't need to prove with <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a>. Nice examples in C++ Lena. <a href="https://github.com/Baduit" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://github.com/Baduit</a>

robrich<a href="https://auth0.com/blog/test-authorization-in-aspnet-core-webapi-with-user-jwts-tool/" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://auth0.com/blog/test-authorization-in-aspnet-core-webapi-with-user-jwts-tool/</a> - using <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/ASPnet" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#ASPnet</a> dev <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/JWTs" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#JWTs</a> in <a href="https://hachyderm.io/tags/UnitTests" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#UnitTests</a>. Awesome article <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/andreachiarelli/" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://www.linkedin.com/in/andreachiarelli/</a>.

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